A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
We, as a society, are distracted constantly - TikTok and Instagram, nonstop breaking news banners, one controversy after another. The bass player and singer known as Thundercat has been doing a lot of deep thinking about that.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "GREAT AMERICANS")
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) Midday, still weird. I'm probably overthinking. Yes, I saw you call. I'm still not calling back 'cause I'm overwhelmed.
MARTÍNEZ: Thundercat's new album is called "Distracted." I talked to him about that and what he calls our dystopian present.
THUNDERCAT: When the fantasy starts to feel like reality versus the reality feeling like fantasy.
MARTÍNEZ: Man, (laughter) yeah.
THUNDERCAT: Good God. Like, it feels like somewhere between the set of the movie "They Live"...
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
THUNDERCAT: ...And, like, a really bad drug trip.
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah. We're distracted by everything.
THUNDERCAT: Everything.
MARTÍNEZ: The deeper question for me is, what are we distracted from?
THUNDERCAT: Oof. Ooh, that's a sinking feeling when you ask that question. Everything from goals to, like, making the right decisions and being able to have peace of mind.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "A.D.D. THROUGH THE ROOF")
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) The pressure's coming up. Remember just to breathe. It's not the end that you're supposed to see.
MARTÍNEZ: You've heard the term attention economy, that we live in an attention economy.
THUNDERCAT: Oh, my God. No, that's the first time I've ever heard that.
MARTÍNEZ: So what I think, hearing your album and seeing the title - it's a distraction economy.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah. We're - it's - it feels like the Nasty Patty from SpongeBob. You know, it's like...
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
THUNDERCAT: ...You bite into it, and then it's just gray. It's like, everything feels like gray area.
MARTÍNEZ: So on this album, you collaborated with Mac Miller.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: Mac Miller, rapper, died in 2018. He was your close friend. We hear him in this song "She Knows Too Much."
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "SHE KNOWS TOO MUCH")
MAC MILLER: (Rapping) She way out of my league. Can't buy her love.
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) Baby, can't buy her love.
MILLER: (Rapping) All the books she read. She know way too much.
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) She knows way too much.
MILLER: (Rapping) Girl, don't know me. You don't know enough.
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) Baby, she don't know me.
MILLER: (Rapping) Said if you don't know me, you don't know enough.
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) Baby, she don't know me.
MARTÍNEZ: First off, it's so great to hear his voice.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: I mean, it just makes me a little sad but it makes me a little happy, if that makes any sense, to hear his voice again like that.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: What was your friendship like with him? I mean, you two were tight.
THUNDERCAT: That was my dude, man. Yeah, no, was one of my closest friends. It was a very hard thing to process. When I see him in my mind, I think I see some of the funnest and greatest moments in my life, you know? It's like, again, everybody saw the moment on the Tiny Desk where it looked - it was like, we were always like that, though.
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah. That Tiny Desk you mentioned, I'll never forget it. And that was back in August of 2018. Mac Miller died a month after that. But on the first song, you were on shaker.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: And then (laughter) people - I mean, I guess the guys in the band were kind of listening to you kind of, you know, do your own thing on the shaker. And Mac noticed it. I mean, I don't know how...
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: ...He could not have noticed it, but he did. And then he goes...
(SOUNDBITE OF TINY DESK CONCERT)
MILLER: That's Thundercat on the shaker.
THUNDERCAT: That's right.
MILLER: Beautiful job, bro.
THUNDERCAT: I was shaking.
MILLER: It was beautiful (laughter).
MARTÍNEZ: It's a real sweet moment, too, though.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah. That's what I mean. It was really - you would be fully who you were in these moments. So it was kind of like, you know, you hand me the shaker, I'm going to be the best damn shaker player. That was us.
MARTÍNEZ: It's like what Chris Rock says about tambourine - being on tambourine.
THUNDERCAT: You better shake this...
MARTÍNEZ: You better...
THUNDERCAT: (Laughter) You better tambourine, [expletive].
MARTÍNEZ: 'Cause no one likes a mad tambourine player.
THUNDERCAT: Exactly. That was, like, you know, the stupidity, the level of, like...
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
THUNDERCAT: What's wrong with you? Like, it - we were always like that. So it was just kind of like - I don't know. When I look back at who he was to me, he was just - he was terrific.
(SOUNDBITE OF THUNDERCAT AND TAME IMPALA SONG, "NO MORE LIES")
MARTÍNEZ: Looking at other songs on the album, the song that I liked the most was the one you did with Tame Impala, "No More Lies." Let's hear "No More Lies."
THUNDERCAT: My man.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "NO MORE LIES")
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) I'm sorry, girl. Didn't mean to drag you in my dreams. Baby, no more lies. Feeling free. That's the way it's supposed to be for you and me.
MARTÍNEZ: So this song, it kind of sounds like you're letting go of a relationship but then leaving the door open.
(LAUGHTER)
MARTÍNEZ: Like, you're apologizing, but not really.
THUNDERCAT: I mean...
MARTÍNEZ: I've been married a long time. I'll...
THUNDERCAT: You still find yourself lying sometimes (laughter)?
MARTÍNEZ: Because I love her.
THUNDERCAT: You lie (laughter)...
MARTÍNEZ: And it's not like - it's not about, like...
THUNDERCAT: ...To protect her.
MARTÍNEZ: It just makes it easier to get through the day with just that little quick lie (laughter).
THUNDERCAT: Apparently, it looks like I like problems. Now, it's more about how you show up, learning to try to show up better. I think at one point, a ex said to me, the truth without compassion is just cruelty. It's kind of haunted me throughout the years, you know, in a sense of, like, the truth is nuanced. Your truth is not necessarily the next person's truth. I mean, the song for me clearly represents a bit of confusion about what it is.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "NO MORE LIES")
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) There's so much work to do. So much to unpack.
MARTÍNEZ: I like what you said, though - the truth without compassion is cruelty.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: 'Cause I always think about the other truth saying that everyone likes to throw out - the truth will set you free.
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: The truth may set you free, but it sets you free basically naked, right? Because...
THUNDERCAT: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: ...You're stripped down completely.
THUNDERCAT: And people don't always want to see you naked, you know?
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
THUNDERCAT: You're not always in shape when those clothes come off. So, you know, you'd be naked, but then it's...
MARTÍNEZ: Every flaw, right?
THUNDERCAT: Somebody may throw up.
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "NO MORE LIES")
TAME IMPALA: (Singing) I'll stay on my own.
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) Unless she wants to, unless she wants to come back.
MARTÍNEZ: So one of the things that I got out of this album, maybe the biggest thing that I got out of this album, "Distracted," is that I got to cut myself some slack when I do get distracted, that it's not necessarily the worst thing in the world to not have a purpose and goal every second of the day.
THUNDERCAT: To be aware...
MARTÍNEZ: Right.
THUNDERCAT: ...Is just as important. You know, that feeling of - that weird sinking feeling after having stared at your phone, knowing that it's similar to a drug, it's like, it should be treated as such, too. Yeah, you should go outside and get some air after looking at your phone, you know. It's like, try to have fun on the internet 'cause it's kind of trash.
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
THUNDERCAT: Realizing that it's military technology that became a big shopping center that also became a giant public access channel. Now, it's like, it's a bit of an ongoing gag. It's just a constant sea of Nasty Patty.
MARTÍNEZ: That is Thundercat. His new album is called "Distracted." Thanks for coming down.
THUNDERCAT: My man.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "I WISH I DIDN'T WASTE YOUR TIME")
THUNDERCAT: (Singing) I think I'm in too deep. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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