LEILA FADEL, HOST:
President Biden says the brutal ordeal for 16 people held in Russia is over. He spoke yesterday following the news that the U.S., its allies and Russia had carried out one of the largest prisoner swaps between Russia and the West since the Cold War ended.
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PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN: The deal that made this possible was a feat of diplomacy and friendship -friendship. Multiple countries helped get this done.
FADEL: Among the freed prisoners were former Marine Paul Whelan and Wall Street Journal reporter Evan Gershkovich. Also released was Vladimir Kara-Murza, a journalist opposition figure then U.S. resident who won the Pulitzer Prize for commentary this year while in detention in Russia. We're joined now by his friend, Alina Polyakova, president and CEO of the Center for European Policy Analysis. Good morning.
ALINA POLYAKOVA: Good morning - great to be here.
FADEL: Thank you for being here. So what was your first reaction when you heard the news of this deal and that your friend was going to be freed?
POLYAKOVA: Well, Vladimir is an exceptional figure and, you know, has many friends in Washington and abroad.
FADEL: Yeah.
POLYAKOVA: But, of course, all of us were elated and following the exchange, you know, second to second, minute by minute, the latest news. It was an incredible day, most of all for his wife and his kids, who are in the United States - a beautiful moment to see them standing next to President Biden when he made the official announcement. It was a good day.
FADEL: Did you think a deal that would free a figure like Vladimir - an opposition figure, a journalist - was possible?
POLYAKOVA: Well, certainly, many of us - myself included and my institution, many other organizations - have been advocating, as soon as Vladimir was arrested, to - for his release among the American citizens as well.
I think what was surprising about this deal is that not only was he included in this but so many Russian nationals who don't have residency in the United States. Vladimir is also unique in that he has British citizenship. So, yeah, he has a lot of allies, but the Russians that were released - you know, I think that's a moment that Vladimir personally is very proud of, I'm guessing, and so would have been Alexei Navalny, who, of course, died in prison before...
FADEL: Right.
POLYAKOVA: ...He could be swapped.
FADEL: What have you heard about how Vladimir Kara-Murza is doing?
POLYAKOVA: You know, Vladimir was in not good health when he was arrested. He is a survivor of two attempts on his life, two poisoning attempts. One had left him in a coma that led to a long and challenging recovery. So certainly being in the brutal conditions of Russian prison was, we know, very debilitating for him. He is - as far as we know, was taken to Germany to receive any attention that he might need. And hopefully, we'll see him back on U.S. soil, back with his family, as soon as possible.
FADEL: Now, you point out there were several Russian nationals released in this deal, along with American residents, citizens and some other Europeans. Why do you think the U.S. and Russia could make a deal now?
POLYAKOVA: Well, it's a great question. There's a couple of reasons, I think, that this was of interest to the Russians in particular. First, these negotiations have been going on for a long time. And I think they knew that if there's a change of the administration in the U.S., however our election go, that will basically stall the negotiations and will have to be restarted.
And we know that Putin personally really wanted Krasikov, who is the Russian FSB assassin being held in Berlin. And the Germans really seemed like they led a really hard deal to give up this criminal who committed murder on German soil in broad daylight in Berlin. And that is why we got the deal that we got. I think that Germany led on this. President Biden alluded to the leadership of Chancellor Scholz, in particular, to release Krasikov, who was the most high-value asset that Putin himself wanted back personally.
FADEL: Is there any larger implications here? I mean, does this signal anything bigger, any type of thawing between the U.S., its allies and Russia? I mean, it's been more than two years since Russia launched its full-scale invasion of Ukraine. Kyiv, as we know, is backed in this conflict by the West, an effort led by Washington. Does this signal any shift, or is it just about this deal?
POLYAKOVA: You know, I would not overinterpret - while this is a significant exchange, certainly, the reality is that the Kremlin sees this as a war. And they see this as a prisoner-of-war exchange, which happen all the time during wartime but doesn't change the conditions on the ground, nor does it signal anything about improving ties between Russia and the West. Russia will continue its war of aggression against Ukraine. Our relationship is unlikely to improve because of this deal, unfortunately.
FADEL: Alina Polyakova, president and CEO of the Center for European Policy Analysis, thank you for your time.
POLYAKOVA: Thank you.
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